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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 12:24 pm 
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Jarcq wrote:
I find it bordering on irresponsible to have a WingMakers forum that does not discuss or is very leery of discussing the various forms of morphing that the mythology is undergoing. There is nothing at all wrong with that . . . James is not a savior to be worshipped and protected . . . 'he' I believe, is a Teacher who chose to be of service to humanity and a Guide as we slowly but surely 'morph' our own way into 'sovereign expressions of Source Reality.'



Jarcq:

First, thank you for the work you have done. This is surely not heresy. If the material has changed, there is certainly nothing wrong with examining that change in detail. IMO, the changes that have been made don’t fit the characteristics of those that would be generated due to issues with “copyright” or “artistic license”. I look forward to hearing what everyone else has to say regarding this.

Perhaps the concept of nonlinear time has something do with the changes?
Maybe control of the materials has been hijacked?

Keep it up…


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:23 am 
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anUther time...i "self" destroyed my own (paint eye placed on windows)...removed it from existance

hmmm - is it the painting on the windows i was impressed with?

Jarcq great work!

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Last edited by The Watcher on Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:39 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:31 am 
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nods...

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:41 am 
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Image

Image

Remembering The Window Dancing With Light

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All The Vows of Faithfulness, all the Ceremonies of love, and all the feelings of hope should be centered and given over to the Sovereign Entity that we each are.
Godless attitudes don't belong in this forum


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:48 am 
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Renovatio wrote:
Jarcq wrote:
I find it bordering on irresponsible to have a WingMakers forum that does not discuss or is very leery of discussing the various forms of morphing that the mythology is undergoing. There is nothing at all wrong with that . . . James is not a savior to be worshipped and protected . . . 'he' I believe, is a Teacher who chose to be of service to humanity and a Guide as we slowly but surely 'morph' our own way into 'sovereign expressions of Source Reality.'



Jarcq:

First, thank you for the work you have done. This is surely not heresy. If the material has changed, there is certainly nothing wrong with examining that change in detail. IMO, the changes that have been made don’t fit the characteristics of those that would be generated due to issues with “copyright” or “artistic license”. I look forward to hearing what everyone else has to say regarding this.

Perhaps the concept of nonlinear time has something do with the changes?
Maybe control of the materials has been hijacked?

Keep it up…


i don't think "Hijacked" more like SOLD perhaps. It was/is a commercial venture even though there is a LOT of free stuff.

Now it's an interesting concept that WeAreUs has. I think it's the same for Wingmakers. I've always 'felt' that it's a GROUP of artists and co-creators. Thus changes in style and materials.

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This is not a time of individual ascension and then dutiful service to teach. . . .
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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2008 12:50 am 
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The Watcher wrote:
Image

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Remembering The Window Dancing With Light



:shock: OGM That is beautiful! I hope not.

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This is not a time of individual ascension and then dutiful service to teach. . . .
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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 8:46 pm 
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Well the Bible has been changed, translated back and forth, interpreted differently, and still some people take it's present form as gospel.
Maybe James will explain the anomalies that Jarcq has brought to light some day, or maybe he might go and change the charactors to Sarah-Anne and Professer Nanderson and the alien race to the Angelus who now reside a mere light year away and are seeking the soul of Doctor Who. Although for some strange reason I think I prefer the Anne and Dr. Anderson interviews.
I just hope that the paintings are left intact and that Mark doesn't change them as he did at Chris' request (surely he should have sought James' permission first!)
Btw I also noticed a change of poem in chamber 23 from the original. Conspiracies abound!! :)


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 9:56 pm 
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ziearmo - you had me laughing out loud . . .
Quote:
Maybe James will explain the anomalies that Jarcq has brought to light some day, or maybe he might go and change the charactors to Sarah-Anne and Professer Nanderson and the alien race to the Angelus who now reside a mere light year away and are seeking the soul of Doctor Who.


I already made a comment somewhere else, essentially that these changes are meant to keep us on our toes so we do not all go to sleep . . . funny, I just realized I have been playing footsie with this material for nearly nine years and I am still as engaged as I was at the beginning. Initially of course there was an innocence to it, now I am quite conscious of how the materials could impact me and to as much a degree as I can, I am choosing the impact . . . thanks for the spontaneous joy :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 6:07 am 
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Well there you are Jarcq; after nine years the materials are still resonating in you!! That's great. I think James said something along the lines that if the WWM were not meant for you at this time then they would gently slip out of your conciousness and you'd be none the wiser and carry on as before. Well nine years later Jarq and I somehow can't see that happening to your good self. I'm a mere few months and every day I hope that my heart still has the thirst for this journey and that I don't fall by the wayside. I still have no idea how I came across the Wingmakers site but I was hooked ; strangely enough it was the original site that I first saw, which even baffles me more as to how I managed to come across it. However I had a hugely powerful feeling looking at Chamber two's painting, so much so that I was a little cautious to look at the others for some time for fear of being too overwhelmed!!
I'm still only at the tip of the tip of the iceberg. The amazing thing I find about WMM is the more you look into them the more they expand, like the paintings have paintings inside the paintings. I Do hope that James does explain the changes some day if even to put my mind at ease that he hasn't got Anne and Dr.anderson locked up in his cellar :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 9:03 pm 
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Ziearmo . . . I think James has us all locked up in his cellar . . . we are all drunk on his wine .. ha .. :) . That's incredible, considering how ubiquitous the new website is and almost nonexistent the old site has become, yet somehow you stumbled on the WingMakers via the old site. There are a lot of things around this material that are non-random, I guess what the Wingmakers call 'event strings.' Have you had a chance to look at the Creator section on the WM website. It has three lists of questions and answers, questions from people that have read the material to James, and James' answers. It is very insightful in many ways. The changes question is also asked but it also seemed as if James was waiting or baiting for more perceptive questions on this subject . . . that's my perspective but I won't stake my life on it. Myth is a very powerful tool when properly applied, I think these Wingmakers are masters at it, heck, they have been perfecting this process of shepherding a species for only God knows how long, but the question is, are we up to the task, can we shadow box with them, give them a run for their mythos, what kind of students are we, you know . . .


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 8:45 pm 
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Here's the link to James' Q & A.

http://www.wingmakers.com/jamesqa.html

~r

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:45 pm 
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this is something i find a little bothersome, and thanx jarcq, chris, oona.
there's a statement, that goes somewhat like this:
"People do not value that which is free", as the reason that there is now charge for......WMM pictures, music, papers, etc.
that "originally" was free for EVERYONE with a functioning computer and a simple dial-up connection. why now, does a viewer need special passwords, and go through various mazes/gates to get to the goodies?

too good? didn't mark say that the reason that he put the old forums up was because of the HUGE demand for?

if this is a true and valid reason, then "relatively", why do people hire armed guards/alarm systems/tracers (RFID chips?) etc. to protect their perceived valuables kept inside their homes instead of leaving their doors wide open, or better yet, right out in the streets?
what's a looter? isn't that someone who values free (to take/have) things?
what would happen, do you think, if ANY shop keeper were to just open their doors and say......everything is free?
would the news get around like flies to s.h.i.t?
have you ever seen women shoppers responding to this sign? jumping jehosephat, they become like perverts in a panty drawer! GET OUT OF THE WAY if you value your life! DO NOT BLOCK THEIR PATH!
Katrina's records showed scenes on the t.v. of people (even the police!) feeling free to help themselves to merchandise in wal-mart stores, that because of the hurricane, became abandoned goods.
some (otherwise typical everyday) people would not leave their treasures and even guarded their homes with guns themselves with the full intension of shooting another human that would value what they valued, and try to have themselves........FOR FREE!

another thing, as chris said:
Quote:
I once convinced Mark that a portion of one of the paintings was slightly wrong and he changed it for me, assuming something had gone wrong somewhere. Later, however, I realized that it was me that was wrong and that the original painting was right as it was which visually didn't make sense but was descriptively correct and so an example of artistic license. When I explained this to Mark in detail he changed the picture back to the original. If he had been the creator there is no way he would have just changed it from the original because of what I said; he would have known I was wrong. No artist would change their original artwork into something that is knowingly wrong.

and i also (personally) do not know of any artists (if they're still around to speak.....so to speak) that would condone/allow "finished, original" artwork to be cut up into pieces and then redistributed (via photo-shop) into other, so called art, in cyber world, cd covers, etc.
people even secure THEIR OWN WORK with copyrights on photographs they've taken themselves and then put out on the web. so that people do not take/have for FREE!

well, that's enough for now. just my ten cents worth. you know inflation and how that works.
g'day

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:39 pm 
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Hello Thyme . . . you’ve touched on one aspect of the WMM that shows how they have narrowed ever since the initial materials were posted on the web. Of course the whole idea that human beings do not value what is free is completely BOGUS. It is precisely the things that lie outside of our monetary value system that are the most valuable, how anyone cannot see that is a suspicious puzzle.

I also just discovered that Mark may be more involved in the creation of these materials than was initially implied. I listened to a snippet of the March 16, 2008 Event Temple music selection and was quite surprised to hear a familiar voice saying “Welcome, I’m Mark Hempel, your host for this inaugural Event Temple session . . .” and realized that this voice is also in some of the WingMakers music selections, for example, as early as the Chamber 10 CD. The same voice also reads the First Source message on page 19 of the Interview 4 secret passages exercise, here: http://www.wingmakers.com/self.html ; also here: http://www.wingmakers.com/mapmaker.asp;
also here, at the end: http://www.wingmakers.com/remember.asp;
Mark’s voice also reads the “Song of Whales poem” and the “Endprogram” in the initial WingMaker’s radio selections.

Mark’s association and degree of involvement with SoulFood seriously deserves a question “mark” over it. My sense is there is a lot more going on behind the scenes in terms of the creation of the “WingMakers” music that is all too human; another example, Charlottemarie’s vocal contributions. There is of course nothing at all wrong with that, the problem becomes one of misrepresentation, for example, the misrepresentation that this music is being exported from our galactic centre. The whole idea of anyone -- entity, individual, alien, or organization -- impersonating the Elohim is a very, very serious transaction because of the ramifications and repercussions involved.


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 2:01 pm 
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and it appears to me that you bear the burden of proving that all of these "humans" are NOT representatives of the Galactic center...when the materials state quite clearly that what we call Humans are unRECOGNIZED and UN REALized Sovereign Entities of the Central Universe (SECUs) :D

Quote:
It's a well-known fact of your scientists that the atomic structure of the human form is derived from particles of stars. Thus, the human instrument is essentially extraterrestrial.

Set this aside for a moment. What animates the human instrument? What is ensouled within the body? Isn't it a consciousness of understanding, borne of the archetype of souls known as First Source? Is this not of extraterrestrial origin?

Both the animating force and the bodies within which this force expresses are not of this earth. What you call humans, we call Sovereign Entities of the Central Universe (SECU -- pronounced SeeQue). SECUs are the alpha and omega. They are not time-bound nor restrained by the adornments of bodies. They are the primal form finished and honed to the perfection of their creator, and in this, we are all the same.

Now, to your point, extraterrestrials are walking around on earth, you just don't recognize them as extraterrestrials because the human genome and the genome of many extraterrestrial races are essentially the same.


Hello...it is time to WAKE UP! and exercise your FULL potential...too

Accept and be grateful for who YOU are
Humbly do the best that you can
to Forgive your own self created IGNORe-ance , and resistance to awareness
have Compassion for those who contribute to the collective Plan and strive patiently with you
and Valiantly strive to assist the entire species to come to this Understanding without Fear or doubts...NOW

UNconditional Love is the most powerful intelligence in the Universe of Universes

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 3:24 pm 
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Quote:
I also just discovered that Mark may be more involved in the creation of these materials than was initially implied. I listened to a snippet of the March 16, 2008 Event Temple music selection and was quite surprised to hear a familiar voice saying “Welcome, I’m Mark Hempel, your host for this inaugural Event Temple session . . .” and realized that this voice is also in some of the WingMakers music selections, for example, as early as the Chamber 10 CD. The same voice also reads the First Source message on page 19 of the Interview 4 secret passages exercise, here: http://www.wingmakers.com/self.html ; also here: http://www.wingmakers.com/mapmaker.asp;
also here, at the end: http://www.wingmakers.com/remember.asp;
Mark’s voice also reads the “Song of Whales poem” and the “Endprogram” in the initial WingMaker’s radio selections.

Mark’s association and degree of involvement with SoulFood seriously deserves a question “mark” over it.


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 7:22 pm 
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Mark has training other than with computers and design . There are many "renaissance" people about. For those not familiar with what that means I guess things can appear to be very mysterious. Like multi -tasking there are those who are multi-talented. And why not? This is the age for such goings on. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:00 pm 
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Yes Shayalana, I appreciate that. What I do not appreciate is misdirection or sleight of hand, or giving an impression that one thing is something when it is entirely another. I feel that we are at a critical juncture in terms of Earth evolution we have to make it clear that those old paradigms of subtle misdirection are over. We do that by being astute in the vast panolpy of material that we are now getting exposed to, and as it were, calling a spade a spade, if and when it is a spade; the Earth mother is counting on us to have this very basic kind of common sense because we are an ambassodor generation for the profound changes that are about to ensue on Earth; we owe that to ourselves and to the generation that will follow ours . . . sincerely, Jarcq


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:11 pm 
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To state it is misdirection presents you with a paradox. Paradox's are to be resolved by looking at them from a perspective not in terms of where the paradox was created or seen from. You rise above it for a broader view and see it beyond the known and discover something new. It gives one incentive to keep striving beyond what is known and not get stuck in complacency and inertia. These materials are riddled with much paradox and the biggest one is that we couldn't possibly understand or know all of this anyway because as human beings we do not have the capacity for such. You figure. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 1:18 pm 
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Misrepresentation not misdirection . . .

Quote:
These materials are riddled with much paradox and the biggest one is that we couldn't possibly understand or know all of this anyway because as human beings we do not have the capacity for such.

We can understand what we can understand unless if we rule ourselves outright from having that capability . . . I am not one to curtail our capacities as human beings and I think we generally tend to underestimate who and what we are . . . but that is another thread.

My point in this instance is quite simple; while the initial impression given by Mark Hempel was that he was basically uninformed about the nature of the WingMaker revelation and was new to the esoteric aspects of the philosophies and that the music was complete when he received it, it turns out he has had a much more involved and participative role in the production of the music ever since the First Source disc, which incidentally created an entirely new take on the music from chambers 1 to 10 which had already been finalized and presented on the initial WM website. I have always wondered why it was necessary to revamp the music from chambers 1 to 10 in the first place. Anyway, all of the Ancient Arrow music — chambers 1 to 24, and specifically by confession, chambers 1 to 17 — as presented on the current WM website has the SoulFood production signature in it.

Mark Hempel was closely involved with Soulfood prior to the WM website upload and has continued to be involved as evidenced by SoulFood’s production of the Ancient Arrow music. And as I pointed out in my post above, Mark has not only facilitated this production, he has also contributed to the music.

Although we may not want to see it or acknowledge it, there is a clear disjuncture or fissure between the initial WM revelation, and what is more and more continuing to appear like the work of another brand of producers posing as the original revealers, or perhaps these producers always were behind the presentation. As Mark Hempel’s voice echoes in the music from the new chamber 10 . . . “tell me the truth now . . .”


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 3:46 pm 
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My point in this instance is quite simple; while the initial impression given by Mark Hempel was that he was basically uninformed about the nature of the WingMaker revelation ...

just in case you haven't noticed....it's been TEN YEARS now since Mark's "initial impressions"

why do you persist on seeing Mark's growth as "slight of hand and misdirection"? These kinds of remarks make you appear somewhat paranoid, and your persistent unfounded accusations reveal an unbalanced perspective.

Earth mother is not a Creator...she is part of the Human experience, and also undergoing her own evolution...right along with us...without any resistance, I might add.





tis a fact jarcq, that we only use a small portion of our brain... and that the majority of our DNA is considered "junk"... according to "scientific fact"

the WMM have provided a way to "enhance" our brains and to activate the "junk" DNA... which they (LTO/Creators) say was part of our template's original design -to be used (of our own free will) when we reached this point in our (species) consciousness - so that we would not be hindered from progressing...we can, of our own free will "transform"... and this will allow us to comprehend a "higher intelligence" and enable us to grasp the "embedded" materials.

course just being here, helps a little...LOL

Quote:
No one who immerses within the WingMakers' data stream will be unaffected. This is because of how the frequencies of the light and sound (from the art and music) will effect the thalamocortical system, and how this system, in turn, effects consciousness. How far the individual immerses in the data stream will define how well they are able to establish these new frequencies in their consciousness (see Chamber Four Philosophy paper for an example of a more complete immersion).


I am assuming that you have avoided the paintings and music, even though you seem to know all about Mark's business with Soulfood...and obviously, both have been "altered" from their original production - without your permission gasp!....and I know you aren't interested in the Fourth Philo...cause it came "later"... so maybe you have missed the experience above (which would explain a great deal)...besides it says one needs to "immerse" themselves in the materials...somewhat like baptism, hee hee, where you at least get your feet wet...even religion has what they call "continued revealation" ... which allows them to keep pace with humanity.

what ever you may have gained from the "original" materials...the rest of us have outgrown :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 10:58 pm 
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Again, instead of going on an assumptive tangent, please respond to this:

Quote:
I also just discovered that Mark may be more involved in the creation of these materials than was initially implied. I listened to a snippet of the March 16, 2008 Event Temple music selection and was quite surprised to hear a familiar voice saying “Welcome, I’m Mark Hempel, your host for this inaugural Event Temple session . . .” and realized that this voice is also in some of the WingMakers music selections, for example, as early as the Chamber 10 CD. The same voice also reads the First Source message on page 19 of the Interview 4 secret passages exercise, here: http://www.wingmakers.com/self.html ; also here: http://www.wingmakers.com/mapmaker.asp;
also here, at the end: http://www.wingmakers.com/remember.asp;
Mark’s voice also reads the “Song of Whales poem” and the “Endprogram” in the initial WingMaker’s radio selections.


Were you aware that this was Mark Hempel's voice in these Wingmaker audio selections? If not, what is your response to the now apparent realization that it was Mark's voice within these musical presentations? Not too difficult and clear questions which I hope you will have direct answers to; if you do not have direct answers to them that's fine too . . . with appreciation.


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 11:22 pm 
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Mark's a musician and no doubt has performed publicly which makes him a perfect candidate for doing a lot of voice work for these materials such as employing the talents of Soulfood as well, amongst other musicians. For whoever has had experience in the performing Arts it is quite common to do what Mark and Soulfood have done. Let's see what we can drum up about Solaris and his brilliant ability in web design which, oh my, Mark does too. And how about that CharlotteMarie and her voice and music and poetry and its utter beauty. I mean having such talents to help in presenting these materials is down right mysterious. Then there is Highwhistler and his interesting website, better check him out too.Why would anyone ever want to have people of such high caliber talent to be involved in this timely and untimely project? :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 11:33 pm 
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I think Jarq is asking for logical answers to illogical changes in the script. If Mark was involved from the start then why not just admit it, explain the reason for the initial story and let it rest. We already know that the 'Myth' is not 100% true, so it follows that any part/s may be 'false' including even 'James' and maybe the original Anne and Dr. Anderson are the real names and the original philos are the true versions. However it's understandable that these things irritate and perplex, since our minds will always try to put things in boxes and neatly store them away and think 'right, now I've got that sussed'. Maybe the frustration of not being able to box WMM helps the process of surrender. But hey Jarq, I empathise !! :-)


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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 11:37 pm 
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Shayalana wrote:
Mark's a musician and no doubt has performed publicly which makes him a perfect candidate for doing a lot of voice work for these materials such as employing the talents of Soulfood as well, amongst other musicians. For whoever has had experience in the performing Arts it is quite common to do what Mark and Soulfood have done. Let's see what we can drum up about Solaris and his brilliant ability in web design which, oh my, Mark does too. And how about that CharlotteMarie and her voice and music and poetry and its utter beauty. I mean having such talents to help in presenting these materials is down right mysterious. Then there is Highwhistler and his interesting website, better check him out too.Why would anyone ever want to have people of such high caliber talent to be involved in this timely and untimely project? :roll:


why*O*why IN.DEED...well ahhh, y'know, ya can't catch a hEAR*D* of psychick horses w/rubber carrots/hay...lol...btb, you know theta mark were workin' for tha DoD too, hey? anna has a psycology degree...also knows how to advertise...er, draw tha markets...hmmm

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 Post subject: Re: Changes to WingMakers Interviews One and Two
PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2008 11:43 pm 
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Location: High Plains of the Front Range of the Rocky Mts in Colorado USA
Were you aware that this was Mark Hempel's voice in these Wingmaker audio selections? If not, what is your response to the now apparent realization that it was Mark's voice within these musical presentations?

NOPE, nor do I care who's voice it is...I appreciate it and am grateful for whomever contributed... I am not one to focus on the floorboards while dancing...really Jarcq ... what difference does it make, when you understand that James does not want recognition, and the less that is known about him...the less that gets twisted... I respect that the most about James...more than anything Soulfood might have contributed...and most likely charlottemarie only added her name because everyone recognized her voice.

from what I have gather....NO ONE is being paid for what they contribute...it is a labor of love...that some can appreciate and want to freely contribute to.

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