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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 3:36 pm 
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Multiversal wrote:
I have to say it has been a culmination of events over the past 10 years . My TA or WN have been trying to give me a little background on myself of which I have kind of tryed to dismiss as coincidental . Also a dear friend of mine from previous lives seems to be insistent that I get off my Ass and be a Man in a more in depth way . I will start a new topic sometime in the near future about the fourth philo paper and what it means to me personally and what it means to other members of the forum .

Would you share what you "experienced" to bring you to this "decision", Multiverse?


Thank you, Multiversal. I appreciate your need to "immerse" yourself. Just one thing... please don't become a "fundie"... steer clear of the trap to believe that the WMM are ALL THE TRUTH THERE IS, and don't throw the baby out with the bath.

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First Source is Source Personality. God is First Source. God is a Person. In Him we live and move and have our Being. In US He lives and moves and IS our BEING.


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 3:59 pm 
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OK, so now after that brief but uplifting intermission, its back to the topic ... the Central Universe !


This snippet from the first interview with Dr N, should give us plenty to chew on for a while ...

Quote:
The central universe is the material home of First Source or the Creator. According to the Corteum, in order to govern the material universe, First Source must inhabit materiality and function in the material universe. The central universe is the material home of First Source and is eternal. It's surrounded by dark gravity bodies that make it essentially invisible even to those galaxies that lie closest to its periphery.

"The Corteum teach that the central universe is stationary and eternal, while the seven superuniverses are creations of time and revolve around the central universe in a counterclockwise rotation. Surrounding these seven superuniverses is "outer" or peripheral space, which is non-physical elementals consisting of non-baryonic matter or antimatter, which rotates around the seven superuniverses in a clockwise rotation. This vast outer space is expansion room for the superuniverses to expand into. The known universe that your astronomers see is mostly a small fragment of our superuniverse and the expansion space at its outermost periphery. Hubble-based astronomy extrapolates, based on a fractional field of view, that there are 50 billion galaxies in our superuniverse, each containing over 100 billion stars. However, most astronomers remain convinced that our universe is singular. It is not -- according to the Corteum."

"On the fringe of the central universe resides the Central Race, which contain the original human DNA template of creation. However, they are such an ancient race that they appear to us as Gods, when indeed they represent our future selves. Time and space are the only variables of distinction. The Central Race is known to some as the creator gods who developed the primal template of the human species and then, working in conjunction with the Life Carriers, seeded the galaxies as the universes expanded. Each of the seven superuniverses has a distinctive purpose and relationship with the central universe via the Central Race based on how the Central Race experimented with the DNA to achieve distinct, but compatible physical embodiments to be soul carriers.

Sarah: "I don't even know what to ask next."

Dr. Neruda: "The Central Race is divided into seven tribes, and they are master geneticists and the progenitors of the humanoid race. In effect, they are our future selves. Quite literally they represent what we will evolve into in time and towards in terms of space."

_________________
"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 4:04 pm 
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FeatherLite wrote:
Multiversal wrote:
I have to say it has been a culmination of events over the past 10 years . My TA or WN have been trying to give me a little background on myself of which I have kind of tryed to dismiss as coincidental . Also a dear friend of mine from previous lives seems to be insistent that I get off my Ass and be a Man in a more in depth way . I will start a new topic sometime in the near future about the fourth philo paper and what it means to me personally and what it means to other members of the forum .

Would you share what you "experienced" to bring you to this "decision", Multiverse?


Thank you, Multiversal. I appreciate your need to "immerse" yourself. Just one thing... please don't become a "fundie"... steer clear of the trap to believe that the WMM are ALL THE TRUTH THERE IS, and don't throw the baby out with the bath.


This is yet another of endless examples of the 'incredulity factor' being used to bait people and divert and distract them from what the primary focus is in discussion and instead inundate it with ennui star that I was telling you about, and we both know what to do about that now, don't we... :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 4:10 pm 
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Keep it up, Shay... :evil:

You are digging your own hole.

You have little, if any, understanding of the Spirit behind the words and teachings of the WMM which is evident by your viciousness that you seem to love to project from your heart. You have no sense of what it means to have any humility. You just love being mean. Very sad.

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First Source is Source Personality. God is First Source. God is a Person. In Him we live and move and have our Being. In US He lives and moves and IS our BEING.


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:06 pm 
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So in a nutshell little bitty planet Earth will be like a way point for future wingmakers that are ever expanding our human instrument(g-nome) into the ever expanding superuniverse 7 . If planet earth functions in a high density plane (furthest planet in super universe 7 from the central universe) we are closer to antimatter than the central universe which is why we are so dense at this time . As we and planet earth evolve into a lighter higher dimension our world will one day be settled in light and life as superunvirse seven expands and puts more distance between earth and the antimatter . First Source needs to expand or all life becomes stagnant and meaningless .


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:10 pm 
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I realize the WMM are not all there is , just think of it as an operation of sorts . So don't worry the operation won't take long and I'll be much better in the morning ! :lol:



FeatherLite wrote:
Multiversal wrote:
I have to say it has been a culmination of events over the past 10 years . My TA or WN have been trying to give me a little background on myself of which I have kind of tryed to dismiss as coincidental . Also a dear friend of mine from previous lives seems to be insistent that I get off my Ass and be a Man in a more in depth way . I will start a new topic sometime in the near future about the fourth philo paper and what it means to me personally and what it means to other members of the forum .

Would you share what you "experienced" to bring you to this "decision", Multiverse?


Thank you, Multiversal. I appreciate your need to "immerse" yourself. Just one thing... please don't become a "fundie"... steer clear of the trap to believe that the WMM are ALL THE TRUTH THERE IS, and don't throw the baby out with the bath.


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:14 pm 
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:D

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:18 pm 
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FeatherLite wrote:
Keep it up, Shay... :evil:

You are digging your own hole.

You have little, if any, understanding of the Spirit behind the words and teachings of the WMM which is evident by your viciousness that you seem to love to project from your heart. You have no sense of what it means to have any humility. You just love being mean. Very sad.


VICTIM ALERT!!! VICTIM ALERT!!! FL ASSUMES NO RESPONSIBILITY FOR HER IGNORANCE SO YET AGAIN BLAMES ME AND INADVERTANTLY OR BLATANTLY TRIES TO MAKE ME LOOK BAD SO SHE CAN LOOK GOOD!!! I AM NOT THE ONE ON THE WMM FORUM DISSING THE WMM IN FAVOR OF SOME HMS BASED ANTIQUATED PSYCHO SYSTEM OF BELIEFS FAR REMOVED FROM WHAT IS HAPPENING ON THIS PLANET,BOT YOU ARE FT!!!AND I AM NOT SAD IN THE LEAST :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Cathedral - CS&N
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MaSU0ABrnY


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:20 pm 
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I do so love to express myself so freely on this unmoderated forum. 8)

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Cathedral - CS&N
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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:42 pm 
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back again to the topic, I see now, that my understanding of the Central Universe, was based upon what I KNOW about my own solar system, where LIGHT (the sun) is the center ... and it (light) appears to be the center of our Milky Way Galaxy too ... obviously I wasn't thinking BIG enough ... considering that Universes are composed of numerous Galaxies and stars ... all of which have the potential to be inhabitable, depending on their relationship to some Light Source ... maybe we are not so inclined to think BIG because it makes us so small :wink:

the first paragraph also settles another issue, that many have debated over for thousands of years ... is FS material ? something I never questioned, myself, because if it wasn't how could it fragment itself and produce "particles" (even quantum particles) but the Corteum seems to be a bit confused ... if the Central Universe is a material "home" for FS ... and FS IS inhabiting it and functioning IN it ...IT is already capable of "governing" ... but the WMMs tell us something else about the entities that FS became when IT fragmented ITself... into individuated consciousness.

Quote:
as First Source birthed the entity consciousness, the WingMakers created the instruments of exploration that enabled this newly formed consciousness to explore the dense vibratory realms of the outermost creation.

Because the vibratory rate of the physical universe is decelerated to such an extent that particles solidify into clusters of objects, time decelerates into sequential frames of perception, allowing the entity consciousness to explore multiple worlds simultaneously. This enables one entity to explore hundreds, if not thousands, of worlds in a single frame of time. This creates the perception -- albeit dimly felt by most of you -- that you have lived before and that you will live again.


isn't "materiality" dense? So if the Central Universe is a "material world" ... that would make it dense too - at least to some extent because the Wingmakers were manifesting "bodies" for the "entity consciousness" ... the Third Philo also goes on to say that they (the entities/SECU) explored for millions of years, as a group ( collectively First Source)... before they reached the outer realms of this Universe ... where their original lightbodies no longer allowed them to actually experience physicality, or individuality

When the entity takes on the light body, it is still essentially formless. Its identity, while separate from First Source, is not separate from other entities within the light body. Thus, it is not yet cast into individuality.

The new vehicles, that the Wingmakers created for the 3rd dimension of Earth allowed it to experience Separation the Third Phase of the Blueprint for exploration which we are experiencing now ... and that actual experience is what gives the entity "true wisdom" ... so far books, even channeled books are not able to give us what FS wants.... which is TRUE WISDOM to be experienced by every entity. (partial of ITs Self)

Quote:
There are numerous revelations that have been brought to your species through non-physical entities in the form of what you term, channeled information. Even parts of your Holy books are channeled. However, these writings were for the few. They did not contain the true wisdom -- they only hinted at the shadow it casts. The Sovereign Integrals will emerge like beacons for your species, and elevate the mental and emotional perceptions of the entire species.

When one Sovereign Integral emerges, it will, by the catalytic forces of its own entity consciousness, cause another to arise, and another, and another, and it will cascade from one to one thousand in a single generation. From this one thousand, will arise one million in the next generation, and from this one million the entire population will arise, imbued with this insight gained from the portal into the multiverse. And from this portal will arise the organization of the true wisdom into a form that will endure against all attacks.

This is the grand unification of the species around the new, non-hierarchal structures that enable the experience of the true wisdom to the newborn of its species in order to perpetuate the unification of the species. Within six generations, the genetic mind of the species is stable and then becomes a powerful tool of exploration that the species will come to understand as its "spaceship" into the multiverse.


True Wisdom is just now beginning to be experienced by some individuals ... but until it is experienced by First Source (collectively all of us) we will not go on to the fourth stage of plan... which is to "transfer knowledge" through out the universe

you may ask what knowledge ? and again, that is revealed in this third Philo:

Quote:
This form of exploration is not simply to discover new geographies or physical states of existence. More importantly, it is to discover new emotional states of perception that enhances the collective wisdom of First Source. Exploration begets wisdom. This is the practical perspective of the entity consciousness, and it is precisely this innate quality that compels the entity to descend into time and density.


no doubt about it, we are most definitely exploring "emotional states of perception" here and now :lol: (it's all good)

(all quotes here from 3rd Philo)

_________________
"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


Last edited by starduster on Fri Oct 15, 2010 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 7:03 pm 
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Multiversal wrote:
So in a nutshell little bitty planet Earth will be like a way point for future wingmakers that are ever expanding our human instrument(g-nome) into the ever expanding superuniverse 7 . If planet earth functions in a high density plane (furthest planet in super universe 7 from the central universe) we are closer to antimatter than the central universe which is why we are so dense at this time . As we and planet earth evolve into a lighter higher dimension our world will one day be settled in light and life as superunvirse seven expands and puts more distance between earth and the antimatter . First Source needs to expand or all life becomes stagnant and meaningless .


OK, my perspective is, I don't believe that Earth is evolving to a higher dimension and James says basically the same thing (see quote below) ... the 3D will always be the 3D even when Earth is resonating at a higher frequency ... just as the first dimension and second dimensions still exist ... the third will continue to exist as a Portal to the Fourth (and multidimensionality)... The Earth was created multi-dimensional, as were we ... we are just getting around to exploring these other dimensions by elevating our own frequencies to match that of the 4th dimension (and some few, the 5th) ... Humanities basis of operation will remain on the 3rd Dimension, because that is where FS lives now ... but that is not to say that there are not many frequencies within that dimension ... as science has validated. Think about one of the primary colors, and how many shades of it there is ... the difference in the dimensions, requires that we change our primary color ... The 4th dimension has an entirely different tone and resonance ... even though the specific "tone" that identifies FS, is totally unique, it is able to penetrate all dimensions ... like a river, with many tributaries that sustain life on earth. These tributaries, as we follow them, lead to First Source ... and there are Zones created by their crossing paths - one on each continent, where we can gain access to larger "streams" ... by allowing them to flow through us, instead of blocking them, the Earth's 3th dimension is greatly enhance - some envision it as "heaven on earth" and some have used these frequencies, to create that vision in their own world's now ... sharing that knowledge assists others to do the same, until the entire 3D dimension of Earth is serving its created purpose harmonically.


The orientation that humanity is emerging from the relative darkness of the 3rd dimension to the 4th dimension is a misconception of the modern-day New Age movement. Humanity evolves to embrace the multiverse, and as it evolves it discovers that its superuniverse is accessible to the human mind in ways that defy logic. This is the stage upon which humanity is entering, and it is not to ascend in a vibratory epiphany to a higher dimension, but rather it is to interact with a broader multiverse of intelligence that heretofore has only been imagined by a handful of humanity's finest representatives.

Humanity will remain in the 3rd dimension, but will increasingly become aware of the higher dimensions while living in the 3rd dimension, even as First Source, its creator, does. First Source lives in the 3rd dimension, but is simultaneously aware of itself throughout the spectrum of the multiverse, and through Source Intelligence, is aware of all life forms in all dimensions. Humanity will ultimately access this same perspective by applying the Grand Portal as a "lens" through which it can gain admission to First Source consciousness. First Source -- in this specific example -- is less God than the archetype of the Wholeness Navigator.
Snipped from Q10 S2 QsandAs from James

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"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 11:13 am 
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Quote:
SO YET AGAIN BLAMES ME AND INADVERTANTLY OR BLATANTLY TRIES TO MAKE ME LOOK BAD SO SHE CAN LOOK GOOD!!!


Awwww :( :(

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Now who is acting like a VICTIM??? :?: :lol: :lol: :lol:

You are so pathetic but somewhat hilarious :!:

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 3:14 pm 
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I am I the only one here that is interested in discussing the Central Universe? ... ok, you are more into personalities ... so here is something that Dr Neruda revealed about the "wingmakers" aka citizens of the Central Race: From the Third Interview :

Quote:
Dr. Neruda: "Fifteen believed that Samantha -- our RV -- could jeopardize our mission because of her ability to make contact with the WingMakers. In two of the three RV sessions she performed, they detected her presence, and they had begun to probe her. Fifteen -- once he had confirmation that these beings were, in all probability, from the Central Race -- became quite alarmed and put a stop to any further RV sessions.

"When I asked him why, he seemed to have some apprehension about their ability to sense our work on BST, and feared that they may put an end to it."

Sarah: "Why?"

Dr. Neruda: "Because they are very powerful beings. What most people consider God, amplify by a factor of a thousand and you would be close to the range of capabilities and power that these beings can wield."

Sarah: "Are you saying these beings are more powerful than God?"

Dr. Neruda: "The problem with your question is that I don't know which God you're referring to. The conception of God in the Bible, or most of our planet's holy books, bears no resemblance to the image of God that I hold in my mind."

_________________
"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 9:55 pm 
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I am especially attracted to what Dr N reveals in the Second Interview because it again mentions frequencies ...

Quote:
Dr. Neruda: "They didn't explain with any precision. They wrote that higher frequencies were emanating from the central universe, and that these seven sites comprised a collective technology that somehow coordinated these frequencies or higher energies to bring about a shift in the planet's vibratory structure, enabling life on the planet to survive the shift and remain undetected by the Animus."

Sarah: "All life forms?"

Dr. Neruda: "Technically, the text didn't specify."

Sarah: "And this was for your eyes only?"

Dr. Neruda: "Yes, the ZEMI operator did not find any evidence of this section of the text. It completely disappeared."

Sarah: "What else did it say?"

Dr. Neruda: "It confirmed that we're dealing with the Central Race, and that they want the cultural artifacts from the seven sites to be shared with the public. These elements were connected to the effectiveness of the defensive weapon."

Sarah: "In what way?"

Dr. Neruda: "In the sense that the materials activate aspects of our DNA that make the shift easier, or perhaps possible, I'm not certain because they were a bit vague."

Sarah: "So, by reading the philosophy I'm supposed to be able to become invisible?"

Dr. Neruda: "I think it's more holistic than that. They left behind poetry, music, paintings, and even a glossary. It seems to me that all of these elements -- in addition to the philosophy -- are connected. Also, I'm suggesting that something fundamentally changes when these materials are absorbed, and perhaps this change, whatever it is, resonates with the technology from the seven sites."

Sarah: "Sounds far-fetched to me. Why do you believe this?"

Dr. Neruda: "I've absorbed the materials and I've noticed changes."

_________________
"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


Last edited by starduster on Sun Oct 17, 2010 1:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Sat Oct 16, 2010 10:06 pm 
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and here is a yummy tidbit that I found in Ch 1 of the AA book ... (rare indeed for me) that contains a message from the Central Race ...

Dr Neruda narates :
Quote:
...humanity has a secret root that spirals into the uncharted realm of the Central Universe of First Source. It is like an umbilical cord that connects the human entity with the nurturing essence of its creator. The secret root is the carrier of the Language of Unity. And it is this language that we have come to teach.

"All life is embedded with what we will term a Wholeness Navigator. This is your core wisdom. It draws you to perceive fragmentary existence as a passageway into wholeness and unity. It is eternal and knows that the secret root exists even though it may seem intangible to your human senses. The Wholeness Navigator is the tireless engine that drives fragmentary, life experience into unified life expression. It is the immutable bridge over which all life will surely pass.

"The Age of Enlightenment is the age of living in the multidimensional universe and appreciating its wholeness, structure, and perfection and then expressing this appreciation through your mind and body into the world of time and space. This is the seed vision of the Wholeness Navigator. The imprint of its purpose. We are here to assist beings like yourself to first conceptualize and then experience the multidimensional universe as it truly is -- not only through the language of your world, but through the Language of Unity; as you see it in these glyphs. As this experience flows through you, you will transform. The Wholeness Navigator will be able to deposit a new perception of your Self that is aligned with the image of First Source. It is this new image, emerging through your Wholeness Navigator, that will change the course of this planetary system. We are here to accelerate the formation of this image in the mind of humanity."

_________________
"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


Last edited by starduster on Sun Oct 17, 2010 1:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:02 am 
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Thanks for sharing that SD. You know I have read and re-read everything from the WMM and LTO , except for the AA book . I feel it may be time to read it . I am also looking forward to settling in this fall/winter with all of the music cds as well .


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:10 am 
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"The Age of Enlightenment is the age of living in the multidimensional universe and appreciating its wholeness, structure, and perfection and then expressing this appreciation through your mind and body into the world of time and space. This is the seed vision of the Wholeness Navigator. The imprint of its purpose. "




The above pretty much sums it up


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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 10:13 am 
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Multiversal wrote:
"The Age of Enlightenment is the age of living in the multidimensional universe and appreciating its wholeness, structure, and perfection and then expressing this appreciation through your mind and body into the world of time and space. This is the seed vision of the Wholeness Navigator. The imprint of its purpose. "
The above pretty much sums it up


In the Project Camelot Interview on page 12 James says we are living now in the Era of Transparency and Expansion.
As I do not know where you got the quote, I can not tell when it was written. Here is what he is calling it now. One of the things one might hold in their mind as they read Lyricus/WMM materials James as refined the vocabulary thought the years. This could be a way to wean us from old thought forms attached to certain words.

Quote:
James:
The Earth is not shifting to a new dimension in order to raise its consciousness and ascend to a higher state. Nor are the fortunate few going to be swept along because they did something better than others and therefore they are the chosen. We, as a human family, are being prepared to live as Sovereign Integrals upon Earth. Will this happen in 2012? No.

2012 will feel like any other year for most people. There is no year or specific time that will define the era of transparency and expansion, the rise of the Sovereign Integral. It is happening quietly in the most unexpected places. People are beginning to see that what has been encoded within their human instrument is a system of control, deception and manipulation. And at some deeper level, they glimpse a new clarity, as fleeting as it might be; they perceive themselves to be more than a system of feelings and thoughts packaged inside a body. This is what is to come... people awakening from a virtual reality inside a virtual reality.


As the energetics from the Central universe come to the planet we are going to be able to live from our Sovereign Integral consciousness. Change is coming our task is to be part of the service to humanity in that change.

_________________
"The Heart is the Temple of Wisdom." John Berges, The Weather Composer, ©2013, WingMakers, LLC
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 Post subject: Re: Dark Gravity Bodies and the Central Universe
PostPosted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 1:30 pm 
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oops I see I forgot to include which chapter of the AA Book, (fixed now) when I posted that quote, but I did mention earlier that I was going down the links provided in the website's search engine, using the key words "Central Universe" :wink:

what is certain, to me, is that we can't assist others if we don't KNOW what we are talking about or have any practical experience (or tools for) tearing down walls :D

The WMMs are a guide book, of sorts, that provide a blue print only ... written by Masters who were once journeymen like me. They can't do it for me, but they are willing to help me learn how to fulfill my potential as a Master, and have provided tools an techniques to ensure my success, so that I may become equals ... and they share this new intelligence with everyone.

"We are what you will become. You are what we have been. Together, we are what define the human soul. Our name, translated to your language, is WingMakers. We are interpenetrated in the light of First Source. You live in the weaker light that has been stepped down to receive you. We bring the Language of Unity into this weaker light so you may see how you will become unified to a new cosmological structure the architecture and grandeur of which you cannot even imagine." snipped from Chapter One of the AA book also... it is almost at the end of the chapter. http://www.wingmakers.com/aap-ch1.html

_________________
"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


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