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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:26 pm 
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Dear starduster, it is not anti-wingmakers. I respect your opinion of me now, but can we not come to a point that you/we forgive and let go? We will never agree on small details and words, but that is not important. We should come to some common ground of peace, where we respect one another and trust that we both do our best, also in regards to the WingMakers materials. We both love the Materials. And even if you don't trust another, the approach of attack has never helped in human history. Valor is not attacking or defending what you think is the truth (see James' email to AMW) which is opinions, but gracefully defending from personal or physical injustice, not by shouting or repeating like an old record, but calmly speak from your heart once - and then witness the power in our hearts.

I'm not saying you should not speak your truth or keep the peace, but some interactions or actions are not good for others too, the group consciousness. I'm sorry I waited so long to express this way, but I did not do because I felt too obviously right or how wrong you were, but then probably you don't forgive me and forget the past for a very similar reason. The way we have been going has proven well enough, that that approach doesn't work. Let's change our approach and solve our problem and forgive and give each other another chance, and not pick on words, in the trust and knowledge that we both mean well and do well. -Christophe - From my heart to yours.

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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:47 pm 
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Nat - it has nothing to do with YOU ... what you believe has NOTHING to do with what the LTO is telling us ... yet you keep promoting your BS ... and it is anti-wingmaker, when you post that Love is an Entity whenever your BS conflicts with the WMMs ... what you are saying is "I am smarter than the LTO " - of course if you have no idea what the WMms say, and you are not willing to give up your BS and bring yourself into alignment with the materials we are here to discuss - then it is completly understandable ... yes I do Understand why you believe what you believe - you consciousness is still fragmented ... and you refuse to do anything about it ... you have wasted our time and yours for six years Nat ... you have been BANNED ... yet here you are - pushing the same ole NEW AGE mumbo jumbo

I am not telling you what to say ... I am telling you that when you spew your BS - whether YOU believe it is true or not ... if it isn't aligned with the WMMs - it IS anti-wingmaker - FORGIVE yourself, Nat, and get with the program ... or go someplace else because your BS is BS ... and it doesn't "help" it confuses others when you say Love is the Quantum Presence ... or that the Quantum Presence is an Entity ... when it ISN't NO MATTER WHAT YOU CHOOSE TO BELIEVE ... if you had read the materials you would know that - and how disrespectful it is to the members of this forum, who actually KNOW what they are taking about - as well as to the LTO and everyone trying to get THE TRUTH out into the collective consciousness of Humanity ... and they come here - to find someone spouting krap - and no one saying a thing ... because they are programed to ignore it and their RI isn't integrated enough to give them the courage they need to express Valor

I have NO opinion of you Nat ... but I do know the difference between NEW AGE mamsy pamsy mumbo jumbo (created by Henry Kissenger as an alternative to Religion) that you have adopted as your BS and the WMMs ... and will call you on it every time you include it in your posts ... to distort the WMMs - I am not promoting my BS ... I am quoting the WMms that reveal NEW INTELLIGENCE - that obviously you are either unaware of, or just can't comprehend due to your present state of consciousness... you choice Nat ... but I promise you - I will not IGNORE it.

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"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:55 pm 
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I have not talked about the quantum presence being an entity, but it is love whatever you may believe, but disagreement is not the reason for this, we are here to discuss these things and not to ban because you disagree. I am open to discuss but you prove you're not as you use this so no discussion with you is even possible because all you say is I am wrong and you are right.

I am that boy beaten into the car by its mother, and you are that mother. The car is the so called "program" but all "programs" are precisely HMS.

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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:28 pm 
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Love is not "whatever you believe" any more than an apple is whatever you believe ... but you CAN believe anything, just don't post it in here NA ...

and you did say Love was the Quantum Presence (of the Sovereign Integral) which confilcts with the WMMs ... the unique perspective of others can enhance our own understanding but you IGNORE them and distort the truth beyond recognition, when you express your BELIEF - which is completely out of alignment with the materials we are discussing here.


Love is a presence, the pure energy of soft and vital presence. ... It is through our breath that we remain in balance and harmony, where the light comes in through us. Then your heart is truly open you can feel it. Here is the calm of the inner being, where the heart beats in this softness that knows no distance. This is the quantum presence. Understanding comes when you softly reach out and listen for the heart of another. This is the future of humanity, this limitless intelligence individuated. I am the heart.

and it isn't "through our Breath that we remain in balance and harmony" ... if that were true everything that breaths would be in balance and harmony - do you see how ridiculous your statements are? We ARE LIght ... it dosen't "come in through us" ... it comes FROM us ... what you post reveals your total ignorance of the WMMs ... for the past six years... do you know how to use the Search Engine in the website - look these things up before you post them and make yourself look IGNORANT ...

... and you can't "listen for the heart of another" because the heart doesn't SPEAK - it uses the HI to do that ... and what comes from the heart of a unique individual - is unique to that INDIVIDUAL because the intelligence that it expresses was designed specifically for INDIVIDUATED CONSCIOUSNESS - and you even though you can share it, unless you and recipient are in the same state of consciousness it won't be comprehended -nor can you "hear" what other's hearts are telling them - and you certainly can't "feel" it either ... and there is NO INNER BEING ... which I have to assume, you are talking the soul of the entity - which again is NOT an ENTITY ... not according to the WMMs which we came here to discuss

if you can't validate your belief by quoting something from the WMMs - it is not appropriate to discuss it in here - no matter how much you BELIEVE it is true - it isn't Universally true, it is only true to you ... not to forget that James has told us to "jettison your BS" and open your mind - both of which you refuse to do which is why you are BANNED

again, to stay with the topic ... I understand why you do what you do ... and so does everyone else here, it is very transparent ... but the WMF is not the appropriate place to promote your personal BS - especially when it conflicts with the WMms that the WMF was created to discuss... and is "anti-wingmaker" in every way possible

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"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


Last edited by starduster on Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:36 pm 
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You don't validate either with quotes, don't project it on me. The heart speaks very much. Why do you suppose James can write after all his words "from my heart to yours" - because it is the heart that has spoken, speak from your heart, and not from the mind that picks on words but be concerned with the spirit behind the words. You see, this comes from the materials what I say. It is in the same spirit, even when words are a little differently put because we are all unique and we don't need any external validation anyway, that has also been repeated over and over. Face this.

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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:29 pm 
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everyone know, Nat, that 95% of my post include quotes ...I don't put quotes in my replys to you, because after a hundred times of doing so and finding that you completely ignore the quotes - I'm not wasting my time anymore. ... I add quotes, so that everyone can discern for themselves if what I say is in alignment or not ... and I didn't say that the heart doesn't express Intuitive intelligence ... but without a mouth it can't SPEAK to others noone can "hear" what the heart relates to the Entity unless it decides to share it - it can only be expressed by the HI - to others ... James shares what his heart reveals to him through his writings ... it isn't "heart to heart" communication because the HEART doesn't have EARS either ... but it is still "from his heart" and he doesn't say ..."from my HEART to yours, it says from my WORLD to yours" because he is living in another model of existence ...

James tells us quite clearly in his interview by Mark, that the heart and mind are INTEGRATED system ... one does not "speak" without the other - original thoughts come from the Heart and move through the mind to be expressed ... it is a joint operation ... there is no time when INTELLIGENCE is being expressed that it doesn't originate from the Heart and pass through the mind ... anything else that it expresses is the stored intelligence of OTHERs ... like every thing you express, comes from some book you read written mostly by people who lived in another age ... that you CHOSE to believe and that you mind refers to when you want to express "intelect" ... or what your mind is capable of retrieving - but the heart still contributes its intelligence - but the HMS distort it .

So if you haven't actually experienced what you are talking about ... you are just repeating what you choose to believe that someone else shared - because we all know, when you research a subject more than one perspective is offered - what you choose to believe is what you share - but there is always something that will conflict with YOUR BS ... ALWAYS ... but there is nothing that conflicts with UNIVERSAL TRUTH ... it is true, no matter where you live, how high your IQ is, what sex your are, how old you are, how much money you have in the bank or what you do for a living or how much education you have... if you haven't experienced the WMMs YOU DON'T KNOW what you are talking about ... which is very obvious to everyone who does know what the WMMs say ...and you aren't talking about the WMMs which is what the WMF was created to do ... you are sharing what YOU BELIEVE ... which isn't necessarily "true" to anyone but you and is why you are BANNED

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"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 7:42 pm 
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The thing is precisely that I only speak first-hand experience, and I think it is the first reason you disappreciate and misunderstand my expressions so much because YOU compare them to what you "know" or have read. I only do this afterwards, so to speak, here, check out how what I say is also said in the materials - and this you can do as well, but your problem here is that you would not look for the analogies and equal equations - which would be listening for the tone of equality - but, to the contrary, you have always preferred to look for the faults. I don't say this is wrong, but ironically you would preach to others it is wrong to look for the faults. I don't mind all this, I can forgive, but it is a fact. By the way, James has concluded with the from my heart to yours phrase on a few occasions, though "world" did come first, earlier in the work and is more generally used as we all know.

Now but why wouldn't you understand these facts?

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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:31 pm 
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It is very moving ....First Source is felt through John ....a gift to us.....thanks again Matt and Darlene .....Path of Unity is working .


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:33 pm 
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Shut up Nat....and listen to what he John has to say.....is that simple for you who is his own worst enemy.


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 10:13 pm 
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Answer 32 – There are reasons that I am not an advocate of initiation levels. It presumes a process can be imposed on, or applied to, the human instrument that is predictive of a prescribed outcome. However, the initiate who is asked to faithfully experience this process is not adequately developed in their awareness to know who is doing the “prescribing” or what is the outcome as it pertains to them as an individual. They are therefore practicing blind faith to an invisible “prescriber” — a condition that entrains the human instrument to a course of gradual awakening and over-reliance to uniform process.

James Q & A



Teacher: The universe watches faithfully your every movement and emotional connection to your goal. The ability to avoid the ill-conceived plan rests mostly in the discovery of your original voice – sorted out from the thousands of voices that have influenced you – and to allow this voice to define and direct your approach to your divinity. It is this voice and the judgment and insight behind it that places you and retains you in the security of the universe.

Lyricus Discourse 4- Universe Relationship (Bolding Mine)



Student: So again, I’m frustrated in ignorance. This seems to be the theme of spiritual matters.

Teacher: It is only because you take the undivided process and leap to its end, wishing to bring it closer into your reality of now. Your patience is exceeded by your vision of what is to be.

Student: I know. But what can I do about it?

Teacher: Define the knowledge that you need to accomplish each step of your process. Don’t profess to need the knowledge of God before you have the knowledge of your earth world or the knowledge of your human instrument. Frame your knowledge in the context of your design.

Student: How do you mean that?

Teacher: You are a physical body with complex, emotional impulses and instincts; you are also a system of nerves and data collectors that feed your consciousness and brain. Moreover, you are a collective of consciousnesses that span your entire species and time. These elements comprise your human instrument.

Like most seekers, you try to understand the mysterious substance of your inmost spirit – the Wholeness Navigator – before you understand your human instrument. And even more to the point, you seek to understand the Creator and sustainer of the Wholeness Navigator before you understand your inmost spirit.

You have intuited the undivided process because it is stored within you, but if you stretch the reach of your understanding it is because you seek to know the stars before you know the planet upon which you stand. And I ask you, what good is the knowledge of the stars when your home is misunderstood?

Student: You’re saying that I need to study my body and mind before I study the soul?

Teacher: No, I’m saying the knowledge of God that you seek is contained in every step of the undivided process. It is not realized in some sudden, elusive revelatory experience at the end of your journey. It is found in every step along the way.

Student: Yes, I understand this in concept. I’ve heard this many times before, but I sense that you’re making a different distinction here.

Teacher: Perhaps. I’m only recommending that you understand the soul carrier before you seek to know the soul, and that you understand the soul before you seek to understand its creator. Otherwise, if you first channel your energy into understanding the Creator, you will see it marginally, and this partial knowledge will deform your understanding of the soul carrier and the soul within it.

Student: But how will I know that my understanding of the soul carrier is adequate so that I can embark on the understanding of my soul?

Teacher: The human instrument is an amazing composite of miraculous connections between the material and non-physical worlds. When you understand these connections, they will guide you to your understanding of the soul within you.

Student: So then I should really be asking you about how I can gain the knowledge of these connections. Is that correct?

Teacher: Yes.

Student: So how do I? Is it the chakras that are key?

Teacher: Much has been said and written about the energy centers that are revealed within the human instrument, but these energy centers are not the connections between the physical and non-physical realms.
What weaves together the physical body with the non-physical bodies is what we refer to as the phantom core.

Student: What is this composed of?

Teacher: The phantom core is not composed of anything material. It is like a shadow of soul consciousness that can move between the realms of the human instrument.

Student: So it can operate equally well within the mind and body?

Teacher: The phantom core is the consciousness that moves between the body, emotions, mind, and genetic mind at speeds greater than light. Yet it is a point of awareness that distributes the experiences of the human instrument to the soul.

Lyricus Discourse 3 - The Nature of Knowledge



I find that when I choose to engage in a conversation on the forum I am drawn into specific areas of the materials. This, to me, is another grand beauty of experience, learning, confidence and gathering of wisdom that never ceases to unfold over time from dedicated immersion into these materials - in essence guiding me along my noble innocent path to becoming more and more conscious of being able to develop into a conscious co-creator of new realities.

Although the quotations I am immediately drawn to are beneficial to my personal journey I trust that the target specific sharing of them may also, at times, assist with guidance and nurturing toward a broadening bandwidth between our connections.


Each individual is an active participant in the reality structures they observe and experience in the worlds of form. This participation occurs primarily through the energy centers of the human instrument and their intersection with the three dimensional world. These energetics, however subtle they may be, are dynamically shaping your reality, imbuing it with perceptual markers that define your ascension path from noble innocent to conscious co-creator of new realities.


Be patient with this practice. The art of the genuine is called an art for a reason. It is not rational like mathematics where you have symmetrical energy input and output. You are opening your consciousness to a field of intelligence that surrounds you at all times. You are attracting this intelligence into your three-dimensional life as a co-creative force. This co-creative force is potent, dynamic, and miraculously intelligent. It will observe your practice before it will emerge to merge.

Art of the Genuine


James – Answer 11: In a word: Practice. The practice of the art of living from the heart, and expressing the six heart virtues of appreciation, compassion, forgiveness, humility, understanding, and valor are key expressions of the highest frequency on this planet: the vibration of equality. When people are enamored by complex spiritual laws, the systems of manifestation, the exploration of cosmology, or the observance of rituals and ceremony, they may fill their minds with information, but ask yourselves: “How is this information leading me to the expression of my heart’s virtues?”

Here’s a hypothetical for your consideration. Imagine if there was an undisclosed text from a credible source that 100 people read. The text was focused on one simple premise: water is a special medium that conforms to your emotional radiation. If you radiate and infuse water with gratitude and love, it will impart a potent dose of well- being and boost your immunity. Of the 100 people reading this text, 50 will consider it a reasonable hypothesis assuming its sources are credible and scientific. Of these 50 people, 25 will try it once or twice. Of these 25, 10 will persist in the practice for a period of 1-14 days. Of these 10, five will persist in the practice for a period more than 14 days. Of these five, two will experiment and create practices that are a creation of their own.

In this hypothetical example, only two percent of the readers actually applied the information persistently, and created something with it, in this case, a technique for infusing water with healing properties. Why did the other 98 readers ignore the information and elect not to put it into practice and create a technique based on the information? In many cases it is because they moved on to the next thing. They found new information to occupy their minds. They are like bumblebees pollinating a field of ideas, where the construct of New is king.

[size=85]INTERVIEW WITH JAMES by Regina Meredith October 28th 2009[/size]


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 10:28 pm 
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I would also like to offer my gratitude to Darlene and family for sharing this wonderful visual and energetic testimony to your beloved John. I feel honored to have been given the opportunity of being brought into the presence and awareness of such a wise, gentle, courageous and compassionate human being - I found it very special to witness a public speaker epitomizing the Coherency of the Heart Virtues so pure and saturated with souls purpose.


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 1:08 am 
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very well put, I was able to thank John, personally shortly after I read the transcript of this speech, and got to express my gratitude for his great contribution to this work - to him via e-mail.
John was a unique individual who has set a wonderful example for us ... and given us the words to activate the the Energetic Hearts of others and greatly contribute to the Grid of Compassion

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"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 1:16 am 
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Tolsap wrote:
I would also like to offer my gratitude to Darlene and family for sharing this wonderful visual and energetic testimony to your beloved John. I feel honored to have been given the opportunity of being brought into the presence and awareness of such a wise, gentle, courageous and compassionate human being - I found it very special to witness a public speaker epitomizing the Coherency of the Heart Virtues so pure and saturated with souls purpose.


:D

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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:10 pm 
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hidelight wrote:
The thing is precisely that I only speak first-hand experience, and I think it is the first reason you disappreciate and misunderstand my expressions so much because YOU compare them to what you "know" or have read. I only do this afterwards, so to speak, here, check out how what I say is also said in the materials - and this you can do as well, but your problem here is that you would not look for the analogies and equal equations - which would be listening for the tone of equality - but, to the contrary, you have always preferred to look for the faults. I don't say this is wrong, but ironically you would preach to others it is wrong to look for the faults. I don't mind all this, I can forgive, but it is a fact. By the way, James has concluded with the from my heart to yours phrase on a few occasions, though "world" did come first, earlier in the work and is more generally used as we all know.

Now but why wouldn't you understand these facts?




I am not looking for faults Nat, I am pointing out to you where your BS is not only, not aligned with the Universal Truth that the WMMs reveal ... but that you obviously have no intention of either reading or discussing the WMMs ... and that it was your choice to resist this awareness of your own free will, that got you banned


we didn't join this forum to discuss what you believe Nat - especially when it directly conflicts with what the materials are revealing - Universal truth ... why DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND that the WMF was created to discuss the WMMs ... and that you got banned for fact that you never have done that once since you have been a member of this forum... nor did you "get" it after you got banned, which simply proves that when the WMMs tell us that these materials can not be comprehended in your present, fragmented state of consciousness - that is Universally true too
, :mrgreen:

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"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 4:38 pm 
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Wing Maker or Animus......we have a choice to be aligned with First Source and feel and see the Light or stay hidden from IT....Anu's distortion......is amazing that Nat does not see this.....James is sharing his compass.....that I am resonating to.....Nat's refusal to read the materials......ignorant of him....and his wanting to replace James as the focus....just rude and wrong....why is he here ?....but to annoy and distract you from the Chambers....where the real Work is being One.


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 1:40 pm 
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Hi spaznozero. Language of externals is all language that talks from the mind, without really listening to the actual expression but the expression is transmitted through the mind and understood with the mind. This means that the language of externals is not an external definition, but rather may apply to all language, if it -- the language -- is so translated by the mind. It's not necessarily inherent in the language itself, but the way the mind itself is listening and interpreting. But then of course the mind begins to speak this way. We get our habit formation.

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Summa Iru


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 6:57 pm 
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2 of you are really morons.....understanding understanding.....all of a sudden easy for me to see how ignorant folk are used by the Animus to not see in the Chambers ...All the Loving Wing Makers there.


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2012 7:00 pm 
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Love is not a law....is a gift from First Source.....you guys work for the Animus.....and are 100% blinded of your employment.......that is no longer required for you to do.....why be a slave when you can be free.


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 9:28 am 
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Mark, Love is a consciousness. When we practice the When-Which-How practice using the six heart virtues and live a love-centered life. We are living in the consciousness of Love. This gives you such a new reality of the power of love, The virtues are the vibrations energies that we can feel and become them in our behaviors.
May our consciousness of Love become our behaviors with greater understanding for ourselves and others.

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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 1:00 pm 
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Thanks Darlene....appreciate your wisdom.....how are you doing ?


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 Post subject: Re: "Understanding" Understanding
PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 11:17 pm 
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James tells us that Love is a frequency (in his interview with Mark) ... and the materials tell us that First Source is Consciousness Glossary ... the tone that eminates from FS/Consciousness, is unique and can not be duplicate, but it can be received and transmitted by an individual in a coherent Sovereign Integral state of consciousness.

By now, we are all familiar with the words and definitions that the LTO have chosen to help us identify Divine Love in MEST... we should also be aware that what the HMS programs associate with what we know as HVs - is designed to conceal our recognition of that frequency - and the dominate reality is also designed to repell it . with the definitions the LTO have given us we can become awareness of and recognize the HVs saturating our existence (find FS in all manifestions and life) ... and identify them. James suggests that we practice using them until they become our only response to the delusions of the dominate reality ... because once we start receiving and transmitting the authentic HV, they will transform the distortion and imbalance caused by believing that they are something they are not.

once consciously immersed in the HVs, the individual also becomes aware that the easiest way to identify a genuine HV, is when they discern a state of being, that is Neutral ... it doesn't "feel" bad or good, (it is incomprehensable to the Human Mind) it isn't neg or positively "charged" with energy ... it is the natural (most comfortable, and prefered) state of being of a fully realized Soveregin Integral - neutral - going with the flow :D

_________________
"...to know this information and then remain passive—a pure observer—is a programmed response, and that is not an answer to how do I best serve truth? It is a denial of truth.” 5th Interview


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